A Staggering Defeat


“It’s impossible.”

That, more or less, was the collective reaction of the Venezuelan political class to last night’s gubernatorial elections result. A government profoundly loathed by vast majorities of the population can’t win a decisive win in regional elections. A party led by a president on 22% approval ratings can’t be electorally competitive. It’s preposterous to even begin to think so and the evidence would obviously bear that out.

As night turned into morning, though, the horrifying insight started to congeal. As opposition spokespeople subtly backed away from earlier claims, we began to realize, this wasn’t going to be like July 30th this year, when evidence of fraud began to pile on almost from the moment the polls closed.

This was going to be like April 2013, when the opposition first signalled fraud but then catastrophically failed to come up with the evidence to back that claim.

You can’t explain a variable with a constant. All of the dirty tricks Ocariz decried have been structural features of the Venezuelan Elections System at least since 2012.

At lunch-time today, defeated Primero Justicia candidate for Miranda State Governor, Carlos Ocariz, gave a profoundly sad news conference. He kept repeating that he had all the actas — the voting tallies produced at each voting center — but that “this isn’t a problem of actas.

It doesn’t take a genius to read between the lines here.

To draw our attention away from the actas, Ocariz kept pounding away on an electoral system rotten from top to bottom: intimidation, vote buying, violence, coercion, harassment of opposition witnesses, ballot stuffing. All credible, all real, all irrelevant.

Because you can’t explain a variable with a constant. All of the dirty tricks Ocariz decried have been structural features of the Venezuelan Elections System at least since 2012. On the margins, they’ve been good enough to turn a narrow MUD polling lead into a narrow PSUV win.

They’ve never taken an election MUD was winning by 25 points and turned it into one it lost by eight. Something else is clearly at play here.

It may be that there was more ballot-stuffing this time than in the past. If there was, forensic analysis of the results data will surely find it, and we’ll certainly write about it in some detail. But I’ll be very surprised if it turns out the bulk of MUD’s underperformance is accounted for by ballot stuffing.

Occam’s razor is pointing in just one direction: MUD voters didn’t turn out. And so we lost.

I think what happened is actually simpler.

We lost, because we didn’t turn out.

And we didn’t turn out for lots of reasons. We didn’t turn out because we didn’t see how state governorships were relevant to the problems facing the country. We didn’t turn out because we sensed the desperation in our candidates’ pitches, and the condescension in their slogans. We didn’t turn out because we stopped trusting a political leadership that’s out of touch, self-serving and more interested in its own power than in helping us. We didn’t turn out because we’ve left the country. We didn’t turn out because if we’re going to take big time risks to vote we want it to be for something we genuinely believe in, and this wasn’t it.

Shocking as the results were, impossible though they seemed, Occam’s razor is pointing in just one direction: MUD voters didn’t turn out. And so we lost.

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  1. Come on, 61% of REP, claimed, 12mm voters processed, claimed, 54% for PSUV/Maduro, vs. maybe 20% at best poll nos. Sure, there was Oppo abstention/disillusionment, sure here was Govt. coercion/threats, but 54% popular support of an unreal 12mm voters???

  2. “I think what happened is actually simpler. We lost, because we didn’t turn out”

    I would believe that if the announced turnout would have been 50 or even 55%, but for a turnout of 61% it would be required that a significant amount of 2015 mud voters going back to the chavista camp.

    There are 2 possible explanations, either they found a way to cheat without forging the actas by having a number of people voting multiple times, wich is easy without the ink, or chavismo is right and all of us in the opposition are crazy, venezuelans love to get their food from the garbage bins and we just can’t resist the charm of a donkey mounted junky, if the latter is the case then we passed the point of no return and should close this blog and everyone of us left in the country should move to Chile inmediately, there would be no point in keeping the fighting then.

  3. Quico, saludos y escribo en inglés para todos, I don’t think that a simple Occam’s Razor analysis will suffice in this case. This is more a multivariate regression than a simple one. One factor simply doesn’t account for enough of the variance to satisfy as an answer. The multivariate answer that I see is, in order of impact: 1) moving centers at the last minute, 2) ‘multivoting’ where one person voted multiple times in Chavista centers, 3) abstention on the part of MUD voters (though this should be sterilized in part by Chavista abstention, 4) ‘electronic’ ie. not real voters, an impact, but doesn’t have to be the go to factor. A key detail is why Chavismo couldn’t match their 8MM for the ANC vote: it would have resulted in an absurdly high voter turnout. Still, the tools that gave you 8MM also gave you a 9% lead. Not Occam’s razor, but more like a traditional Tammany Hall haircut.

  4. So naive.

    They stole around 6 million votes.
    Just like any other time.

    If we refuse to believe it yet again we are doomed to repeat the same plot again and again, and again.

    Truly remarkable.

        • Said as only someone who has never participated as a witness in an election could. If the machine numbers don’t tally up with the actas, it’s the easiest thing to prove and there are people checking that every election.

          The only people who keep talking shit about the machines are those who don’t understand the electoral process. The government does commit fraud, yes, but it’s not with the freaking machines, it’s with all the advantages they give themselves during the voting process.

          • I wasn’t a table witness, that’s true, but I remember having to be the one exiting the voting center past 11pm during the 2006 presidential election because I was the only one willing to take the actas because all the coordinadora democrática witnesses had left hours before thinking the deed was done.

            Besides, read the law of electoral processes again, it clearly says that “Venezuela’s voting system is electronic”, so chavismo can read that as “Machine kills votes”, simple as that.

            The papers don’t matter, they never did, and they never will.

            That is the reason that no one will ever be able to prove the fraud ever.

            They stuff as many votes as they want and MUD is still blindly flailing thinking that “keeping witnesses in the tables” will do anything to prevent the fraud, moreover when they’re even kicked away at gunpoint.

            It’s you the one who doesn’t know anything about the electoral system in Venezuela.

          • Actas no es lo mismo que el conteo de las papeletas, y por eso la auditoría implica que deben contarse las papeletas y cotejarse con lo que ha salido impreso en las actas.

            Si la MUD se quedó con el mensaje de que lo que está en las actas es la única prueba que tienen pero no mencionan para nada el contenido de las urnas, pues quiere decir que no hicieron la auditoría de las mesas como se debía, fuera porque los testigos de mesa se fueron, cosa que ha pasado bastantes veces, sea porque los militares y los colectivos se robaron las urnas, cosa que ha venido pasando en las últimas elecciones, o porque los funcionarios del CNE no han querido que se abran las urnas, cosa que también ha pasado, y he visto, y los testigos acreditados no lo han protestado ni exigieron que se abrieran.

            Mire el problema de la MUD es que sí, mucha gente dejó de ir a votar (no sólo los que se fueron a la playa, que muchos no deben ser porque de ¿dónde se paga ir a la playa hoy?), pero lo peor es que perdieron mucha de la movilización de sus testigos, los testigos seguramente están tanto o más decepcionados que los votantes, la gente en esta elección seguramente no se quedó dispuesta a caerse a golpes en los centros de madrugada como en 2015, porque simplemente recuerdan como la MUD mandó a la gente a matarse en la calle para luego de 100 muertos decirle a esa misma gente que eran unos locos reaccionarios guarimberos y que había que explorar diálogos.

            La MUD defenestró su capital político, que era la movilización y la organización electoral. Todavía quieren venderle a la gente que este problema lo arreglan los votos, pero no quieren entender que no es posible, o bien ya están conformes, con la idea de que la gobernabilidad cómoda es lo único que les interesa para el día que eventualmente les dejen ganar una elección.

      • “they stole 6 million votes but that doesn’t show up in the actas because magic.”
        Magic is not the right word.

        They stole 6 millions votes because “dictatorship”.

        It has been happening since 2004, at least.


        Smartmatic has basically admitted to this.

        The sooner we admit this the closer we will be to figuring out a way to defeating these thugs.

        Just breathe and say it slowly, “they stole around 6 million votes….again”.

        The truth will set you free.

          • They didn’t won 2004 either, they stole that election too.

            In fact, it was from there that all the elections were rigged, the only cases when they were stopped were when sectors of the armed forces threatened with a coup the next day if they didn’t acknowledge their loss.

          • Just listen to yourself, Luis.
            If it wasn’t fair and square then they stole it!

            Time to snap out of the brainwash

      • Quico, too bad Octavio isn’t around to put you in your place. You have no brakes and I don’t trust your words any more. You may be a DPB for all I know.

        *Deep Penetration Blogger

    • MRubio,
      I tried calling you @ 8:30 this evening. I have global calling and it is only 6,400 Bolivars a minute. What a bargain!
      If Yahoo won’t work, this will need to.
      I am going to ask a friend in Caracas to contact you and pass on address info for shipping to me.

      • John, still no internet service for my desktop and only spotty for this telephone. Have your friend message me first and I’ll respond promptly by calling him direct.

        • MRubio
          She will be calling today. I tried to use Skype to talk to her. The internet has deteriorated and it would not work. I messaged your phone number to her.
          The seed company sent me an e-mail yesterday saying that the order is all put together. I wanted to pick it up last Friday but they didn’t have it done. I will have it by the end of the week.
          They put together the whole 2000 seed packs.

          • Spoke with her this morning John. She talked me out of the agro-chemicals, seed only. Later today I’ll send her contact & shipping info, Guanta near Pto La Cruz will be the best shipping point since D-I-L lines there.

  5. It could just be a low turnout story for the opposition. But its odd that over 7M people would turn out for a symbolic, non-binding referendum in July and now three months later only 4.8M would turn out for an actual election, even if that election was for largely powerless governors. Most of the factors Quico mentions as working against MUD turnout yesterday were also present over the summer. So that is also explaining change with a constant in a way.

    • I don’t quite see it like that. The summer vote was about regime change. This is about who maintains regional highways. There was a sense of mission on July 16th that was entirely absent yesterday.

      • I can see that argument – the referendum was symbolic but the message was very fundamental in some ways. Still, that is a really big drop (like 30%) in turnout in only a few months.

          • Have you ever pondered if claiming the country is under authoritarian rule one day, and insisting participation in elections the next sends a somewhat ambigious message?

        • I don’t think the abstention was the only reason, but I believe it made a big difference. In the Cafetal and Chuao center that I saw, the crowds were rather small, even for gubernatorial elections. If we had had a turn out of some 7 milion, at least it would have made it a bit more difficult for the government to fudge the numbers.

          I don’t think elections are going to lead to a government change, but have no idea of what realistically would. I can no longer attend marches and have no clue what else I can do, so for now I will have to rely on voting even though the chances of making a difference are small, but better than nothing.

  6. Continuing comments: MUD had two choices: 1) participate ‘as is’, or 2) not participate… a lesser of two evils situation. If No. 1: maybe you win some, lose some or win a couple, lose most; if No. 2, you forfeit and
    thus lose all, a la the 2005 AN election. You really cannot win, all you can do is make the government lose more. In case No. 1, the gov’t (ie. CNE) has lost local plus int’l credibility. Elections will never be seen as ‘free and fair’ again under this or a similar CNE. Major loss for the gov’t. In case No. 2, they get off scott free w/o any fallout since the other side ‘forfeited’. I think MCM is wrong, ’tis better to have voted and lost, than not to have voted at all’. The result will be a healthy radicalization of the opposition, new faces in leadership roles (bye bye JB, HRA, others) and more discredit to the gov’t. BTW, sooner rather than later they are going to need AN approved loans and then ‘te agarro en la bajaíta’.

      • “Mardito Allup, viejo mamaguevo ese, nojoda vale con los putos adecos son la misma mierda que el psuv”

        Source: PeopleLeaks. Every other conversation about politics

    • Esos escenarios serían creíbles si la MUD hubiera ido con un plan para el escenario “nos van a hacer fraude” y estas elecciones vamos a demostrar el fraude. Una cosa es que dejes de ir como en 2005 y regales el espacio político, otra que vayas como un pendejo creyendo que por mera convicción las cosas se dan, y otra muy diferente que lo hagas con la debida malicia para obtener un objetivo concreto.

      De partida el objetivo de la MUD era errado, decirle a la gente que los gobernadores tienen una utilidad no caló, porque la gente sabe que un gobernador sin asamblea que le apruebe presupuestos, ni policías que salgan a coger malandros, no sirve para más que cobrar un sueldo y robar minutos en prensa.

      La otra idea, no hay que abandonar espacios, pues repitieron la misma que en las elecciones de 2012 y 2013, muchos diputados se hicieron diputados para abandonar el curul e irse a donde las contrataciones les permitían comisiones.

      La MUD sabía que el proceso era fraudulento en fase pre, durante y post; cuál fue la estrategia para develarlo? ir a votar y creer en encuestas? pues bien mala que ha sido.

      Por cierto, nadie menciona que uno de tantos factores, sino el más para que Ocariz no ganase irrefutablemente, es que la gente tiene memoria, en uno de los estados con la población más antichavizta la gente se acuerda quién fue el que permitió que metieran presos a unos tontos que se robaron unas armas de un cuartel, el cuentico de “yo no sabía” y esa cara de “señora no sé de qué está hablando” cuando lo increpó la mujer del capitán aquél se le quedó grabada a muchos, y ninguno de los que han salido a caerse a golpes y a recibir tiros en las calles durante las protestas iba a votar por alguien que no arriesga nada por ellos.

      La gente tiene memoria, pero la MUD parece que no lo entiende.

      A Ocariz lo hubieran cambiado por cualquier carajo, y capaz otro hubiera sido el cuento en Miranda, y no digo que hubiera el gobierno dejado de trampear resultados, pero la diferencia hubiera sido tan incontestable como en 2012, que hubieran tenido que aceptar que perdieron aunque nunca se supiera por cuánto. Lara también puede ser un sitio para reflexionar sobre a quiénes ponemos como candidatos y que no valen aquellos que negocian dejar que los colectivos saqueen urbanizaciones aunque sepas de dónde salen todos los días y los estés viendo casi desde la ventana de tu oficina.

  7. Let me add some numbers to this (surely to be very civilized) conversation:

    (First, note that yesterday Distrito Capital didn’t vote)

    PSUV: 5.57 million votes
    MUD: 4.85

    2015 elections (without votes from Distrito Capital):
    PSUV: 5.16 million votes
    MUD: 7.06

    2017 vs. 2015:
    PSUV: +0.40 million votes
    MUD: -2.20

    • So, 400K chavistas no maduristas were brought back into the fold (possibly by regional-oriented campaigns that minimized mentions of the central government), and over two million oppos remained disillusioned after the capitulation post-30J and stayed home.

      The comment section is going to hate me, but this sound very plausible to me.

  8. I understand the reasons for low turnout for opposition, BUT what explains the gains in PSUV? To me this is the key question.
    If there is no fraud / ballot stuffing / etc, how do the PSUV got people to vote, and vote for them?

    • I just don’t think there are enough committed ideological abstencionistas to make a statistical difference. They’re loud, sure. They’re an infestation on twitter, and on this comment board, certainly. But you put all those guys together and you can fill maybe half a Poliedro.

      I don’t think that’s what this is about. This is about something more diffuse, with deeper reach into Venezuelan society. This is about demobilization-via-hopelessness.

  9. “We lost, because we didn’t turn out.”

    MUD is the one who lost, and MUD lost because it failed to perform as they needed to. MUD politicians can go f** themselves and they should not even dare to trow fault at the people for their own embarassments.

    The people rallied, protested, voted time and time again, suffered persecution, people lost family, lost their business, their property, etc and even after all that people voted on 16j, went to the plebiscite, etc, etc And MUD always failed to their promises and always failed to hear the popular mandates.

    Its time for leaders and politicians to be held accountable. Enough of this “its the people`s fault ” crap. Allup, Rosales and Falcòn can choke on their own vomit for all i care.

    • MUD lost because they also treated their base as a piece of garbage on the base that “no matter what we put there, chavismo is worse, so they’ll vote for our candidates”

      • Pretty much,

        At one point this country traded a functional dictator for a disfunctional democracy, and the second proved to be way worse and its lead us into a disfunctional dictatorship.

        Of course people are disenfranchised and apathetic. what the MUD is offering being monopolized by AD, PJ and UNT is a total scam and the same kind of politics that cause the debacle in the first place.

        Venezuela needs a functional democracy, any less is a scam and not something we should just settle with. If the opposition is not offering a real alternative they are not opposition and their leadership may be revoked.

  10. “We lost, because we didn’t turn out.”


    “f***g abstentionists with their stupid slippers bashing keyboards asking for blood! motherf*****g ninís who don’t care about anything less than the playita! Venezuela deserves to continue being sodomized by the cuban invaders!”

    Aw, man, you were going out so well, but suddenly decided to return into the cozy safety zone of “Everything is the ninís’ fault”

    Let’s wait for the MUD statement claiming that “too bad, you’ll have to wait a couple more of years, because there wasn’t any fraud at all, the electoral system is clean, nice and pretty, it’s just that the ‘triquiñuelas’ made it more difficult, but the fault is entirely on those mean, miserable ninís who don’t care enough to vote, ÑO ÑO ÑO! (>.<)"

    This is the worst of the scenarios playing out.



    The law says that because the voting system is electronic, it means that all the actas and ballots are COMPLETELY-EFFIN-FRIGGIN' WORTHLESS.

    • “Venezuela deserves to continue being sodomized by the cuban invaders!”
      YES YES YES YES YES… did I say YES. Couldn’t have put it better myself. Los venezolanos merecen este narco CUBANO comunista MIERDA dictadura. …. all day every day for many many many years to come. Lets see what “el bravo pueblo” does when thousands upon thousands die of hunger.

      • En realidad yo no digo que los venezolanos se merezcan la maldición chaveca, yo lo escribí ahí como el sinónimo de la ridiculez que es venir a decir que el chavismo no hizo fraude en estas elecciones, porque ese es el mantra eterno de los votófilos, de culpar de todo a quien sea y lo que sea MENOS al chavismo y su trácala electorera.

  11. Lula’s party on the Venezuelan elections:

    “Venezuela is once again an example of democracy and civic participation”

    And who can disagree with that?

    You had your elections, it didn’t work out as predicted (by you), very unfortunately, but now you have to focus on the next elections. That is how democracies work, isn’t it?

    Congratulations to MUD, Quico, Naky and all the ones who helped legitimize Maduro and his government once again. That was no easy task, buy you made it! I give you that.


  12. Alright, I need some SERIOUS help understanding Kiko’s argument… You are essentially basing your analysis on what the well known CNE is announcing? These guys have committed fraud since 2004… But ok, lets not go there.. They openly committed fraud 3 months ago…. But those numbers were fake and these numbers are real? How is that even an analysis?!

    That is LITERALLY as ridiculous as using indautiabe BCV or Fonden numbers numbers to understand whats going on with the economy… this makes no sense..

  13. Occam’s Razor pointed at a fraud commited by chavismo.

    MUD’s information monopoly chooses to use the excuse of “it’s all the ninís’ fault”

  14. There was nothing good coming out of these elections for Chavismo. Their choices were to destroy their myth of popular support or reaffirm they are cheats. They chose the later, it is the least damaging because they are already tainted as cheats.

    With that behind us, we now wait for the impending credit event and we wait and see how the military will react when their plunder and loot becomes more meager.

  15. People exercised their right and (in my view) their obligation as citizens under that Constitution to vote. They had options to vote out the PSUV. However, the manner in which the elections were held deprived them of the fair exercise of that right, even before the ballots were counted.

    The vote was “lost” in a literal and narrow sense, but not in a meaningful way. This is because we all know the shenanigans that went on -irrespective of the vote count- that tilted the elections in favour of the PSUV. Including what are obvious forms of voter suppression.

    Now, the result is in, and the only thing that has changed is that Chavismo has controlled one more unfair vote. That does not taint people who exercised their right to vote, unless we are in the business of blaming the victims of this unfair system. Am I to blame if I seek habeus corpus from a court to get my family member released, and I know the courts are corrupt?

    The question is then, are the abstentionists responsible for “losing” the vote? The absentionists got the outcome they expected. They didn’t lose anything because they cast no vote that was stolen. But to say they are responsible for the outcome suggests that the regime would have recognized a large victory for the opposition. Given the regime’s behavior, that is speculation.

    I don’t think blaming the voters, or the non voters, gets us anywhere except where the regime wants the opposition: fighting among themselves. The people who voted performed their duty to the extent that they could within a rigged system, and so they are not the perpetrators here. People who didn’t participate cannot complain that their vote was stolen in this election, but they can still complain that elections are not fair, there is no rule of law in Venezuela, etc etc.

    People are angry. The result is absurd. It is a joke. Maduro’s face and those around him during his “victory” speech was everything we needed to know about the legitimacy of the result. The opposition must continue to rally and organize support, and pursue multiple fronts.

    • You are right. Voters didn’ t do anything bad. But they were misled. The truth is that as long as enough people believe that it is possible to beat this dictatorship with votes, we will never be free. The funny thing is that I strongly believe that a lot of people would actually prefer other alternatives and support them.

      To say that we lost this election because people didn’ t care to vote means that we still believe that voting is the solution. And that is the fundamental mistake here. The truth is people didn’ t vote because they know that voting is useless, and there is no way to prove them wrong. The message is clear.

      I agree with Mr. Toro that the abstencionism is not relevant.

      What the MUD supporters are trying to ignore is their responsability in pushing for an election that was not only rigged, but meaningless to people.

    • Canucklehead “The opposition must continue to rally and organize support, and pursue multiple fronts” Are you on crack mate? Living in LaLaland? Out of your freaking mind? What universe are you living in? Never ever again does MUD have a fighting chance, they fubar’ed that after selling out and ONLY thinking of getting a governorship and all the “opportunities” that come with it. They had so many chances after winning the AN but managed to fuck it up every single chance the had. Even the average Venezuelan isn’t That dumb to give those cunts another chance. Cubazuela is here to stay, taking my hat of to those Narco Cuban pieces of shit, I for one never underestimated them, as my posts show.

  16. I was afraid that it may come to this, but the overall numbers are not that crazy.
    The Chavismo played us we lost in fell into their trap every single step of way.
    The Chavismo knew that they were going to lose. They’re only chance they had was to divide us and have low turn out so the ballot stuffing would work.
    The ANC election, I have no doubt was rigged but the main mission of that election was to divide us and put us in an impossible situation.
    Think about it Ocariz had a bunch of bad press through the campaign and even Nacho didn’t want his music to be associated with Ocariz.

    The Chavismo only got 400K votes more than in 2015. With the amount of people that rely on government assistant, some ballot stuffing, and how bad the MUD fared in the last few months. this is not an insane number.

    • Uh, no.

      If there isn’t fraud involved, then the july 30’s EIGHT AND HALF MILLION CHAVISTAS MUST BE ACKNOWLEDGED as hardcorest fanatic and zealously revolutinary voters.

      So suddenly half the country decided to rush to vote for that and somehow they didn’t vote in the same scale for this?

      YEAH, SURE.

      It’s a fraud, period.

  17. I think you guys over-analyze things too much. Chavismo has been stealing elections for quite some time. The Cubans are behind it; they have been manipulating the figures by injecting votes into the system in ways which the MUD has no clue. The MUD does not have the training that the Cubans got from the Russians and Easter Europeans Communist countries to control the governing system. The opposition in Venezuela is so naive. Venezuela has a long way to go before it can be truly free. By the way, the solution of the Venezuela problem begins with Cuba.

  18. Lo más sencillo y lo más natural es no participar en elecciones no libres. Ya una vez que uno se mete en ese laberinto de mierda, nunca sale. Su vida se va a convertir en una pesadilla llena de números dudosos y análisis rebuscados y contradictorios.

    Yo diría que aplicando realmente el principio de la hojilla de Occam, la explicación más sencilla a todo esto es…que los carajos de la MUD son unos unos hijos de puta. Lo digo en serio.

    Lo que pasa ahora es que los políticos se dieron cuenta de que tiene más sentido echarle la culpa a la abstención (aunque la participación fue supuestamente del 61%) que aceptar que fue una mala decisión participar y que no son suficientemente inteligentes como para desenmascarar el fraude y probarlo.

    Si declaran que hubo fraude corren el riesgo de ir presos y además…ya están pensando en las municipales y en las presidenciales y no les conviene ir por ese camino.

    Estas personas nunca van a reconocer que la salida electoral es imposible. Básicamente porque viven de las elecciones, aunque sean elecciones no libres

    El CNE nunca fue confiable, el PSUV nunca fue confiable, la MUD nunca fue confiable.
    Las elecciones nunca fueron libres. La voluntad de los electores nunca fue un factor

    . De ese enredo no se puede salir. Por eso es que uno no debe entrar. Incluso por su propia salud.

    Yo no voté y me siento mucho mejor que los que votaron. No porque yo celebre la miseria ajena ni porque crea que estamos más cerca ahora de la salida del régimen, sino porque no me cubrí de mierda al meterme en algo muy dudoso e inútil. Tener la conciencia tranquila me da un plus de energía y de lucidez. Es una forma de conservar mi integridad a pesar del contexto. Piénsenlo.

    Por otra parte, la dictadura realmente obtuvo lo que quería, abrirle paso a la ANC.

  19. No mijo, perdimos porque la MUD se limpió literalmente el culo con 165 muertos, 15,000 heridos, 5,000 presos y casi 200 dias del pais paralizado.

    Apunta para otro lado que no fueron los votantes que faltaron, sino la gran desilusión de la Mud & Co. encabezada por el reptil llamado Ramos Allup y el siempre obediente y ponderado Julio Borges.

    En cuanto al punto sobre la trampa chavestiaoide que esgrime el Sr. Ocariz, eso cuento es tan viejo y tan inútil como el cuento de la guerra económica. La MUD debería a estas alturas (si no lo ha hecho en los últimos 5 años) saber con quién esta lidiando y tener los mecanismos para manejar la trampa. En otras palabras, quién coño (pardon my French) va a ir a elecciones con el mismo CNE que trajo el fraude de la ANC?. Quién carajo acepta unas elecciones adelantadas, de un CNE que ha manipulado el tiempo de las elecciones a la conveniencia de Maduro. Por qué no se uso la oportunidad para negociar la liberación de los presos politicos a cambio de ir a las urnas?. Ahh ya sé, Allup y Borges; el primero por poder y el segundo por _____________ (fill the space).

    La MUD como organización esta dispuesta a sacrificar vidas, no solo las que se perdieron (y las que se van a perder), la libertad y la salud mental de los presos politicos, la economia de las familias y del pais en general, e incluso quemar capital polítco al caer en una y otra vez en negociaciones esteriles y con resultados casi pronosticables con un gobierno que le sirve tener precisamente ese tipo de oposición.

    Una organización que tiene tanto “guaramo” para asumir esos tremendos sacrficios no parece entender como ganar con tanto a su favor. Quizas es verdad eso que dicen, que solo en Venezuela pasan esas cosas.

    La gran illusion sería ver que los cinco gobernadores de la MUD honren a los muertos, heridos y presos del regimen de Maduro negandose a juramentarse ante el adefesio de la ANC.

    PS.: Como jugar un juego de bolas criollas sin bolas..no sé? dime tú…

    • “No mijo, perdimos porque la MUD se limpió literalmente el culo con 165 muertos, 15,000 heridos, 5,000 presos y casi 200 dias del pais paralizado.

      Apunta para otro lado que no fueron los votantes que faltaron, sino la gran desilusión de la Mud & Co. encabezada por el reptil llamado Ramos Allup y el siempre obediente y ponderado Julio Borges.”

      ASÍ ES no jodaaaaaaaas!!!!!!!!! MUD = Chavistas INCÓGNITO!!!!!

  20. “Occam’s razor is pointing in just one direction: MUD voters didn’t turn out. And so we lost.”

    For one second I thought it was one of those click-bait advertisements you see around the internet.

    Mr. Toro, you have always strike me as a smart, shrew and truly concerned journalist/blogger/communicator. However, I may say, your last sentence not only oversimplifies the issue but puts the blame squarely in the people and not in the leadership of the MUD.

    I have always sensed your bias onto not getting too hard at the several and sometimes very deep and troublesome mistakes the MUD make with certain frequency. I am not sure why, perhaps we do not need to mud the MUD any further than they do mud themselves. Or CC has evolved onto a business which requires a level of restrain in order to ensure viability of the model. Or perhaps the role of sharp unfiltered MUD criticism is handled by Ms. Duarte.

    Whatever the reasons you may have to point fingers at us; I would certainly refresh your memory of what transpired about six months ago, and appeal at your remarkable powers of analysis to see that this is the result of betrayal. The betrayal of the MUD to the 6-7 million of Venezuelans looking for change, to the 165 people that lost their lives and to the hundreds (or thousands) currently in jail.

    You may say that the MUD got cornered and fought for survival. That they run out of choices or they got a very sour lemon and don’t know how to make lemonade. I don’t believe any of those arguments due to the fact the MUD is an organization ready to shut-down a country for almost 200 days and bring the best and the worst out of the enemy, as long as there were people thinking that a cardboard shield would stop a .38 bullet.

    Whether or not the chavestias tricked the system is beyond discussion. You most be either very naïve or extremely pragmatic for believing in a clean election.

    I would have preferred a closing sentence that would have said:

    ‘Occam’s razor failed to grasp the fact that the MUD electorate was exhausted and disenfranchised after the surprising surrender of the spirit of the 2017 protests conducted by Mr. Allup and endorsed by Mr. Borges”.

    That would have been a click-bait for all the good and the wrong reasons.

  21. An old bromide from the minds of addicts pretty well sums up the situation, “You can’t make sense out of insanity.” So many suffering souls in Venezuela and still the only option being considered is flight never mind the fight, fight is a nonstarter. Like Cubans the Venezuelans seem to think diplomatic pressure and international sanctions will be a catalyst for change. Make a list of the countries where this ploy has worked. Damn short list. While the leftophiles await the regime change created by the horrors of diplomatic pressure they can use the time documenting the deaths of Venezuela’s most vulnerable citizens.

  22. “Es todo culpa de los abstencionistas los cuales no representan un porcentaje significativo porque todos juntos no llenan un poliedro”

    Los contrasentidos que hay que leer que tratan de justificar el disco que está más rayado que aquel de “mequierenmatá”

    Por cierto, eso de que “es que es algo más, algo difuso y sin forma que es cualquier cosa ¡Menos fraude, ojo, el fraude es IMPOSIBLE! ¡ÑOÑOÑO!” es lo de querer conseguirle las cinco patas al gato.

    Por cierto, otro más que salió a “defender con el pellejo los votos”, no joda:


    “resaltó que no necesita estar al frente de un cargo público para “hacer el bien”, al tiempo que aseguró volverá a barriadas larenses.”

    Que vaina tan patética.

    Si yo viviera en ese estado, le zamparía un cascotazo cuando lo viera.

    • The US has many cards in its hand. We ain’t seen nothing yet. Cannot comment on future execution, there obviously are many issues to be resolved

  23. It’s all very simple, the opposition has not gotten it, they just don’t get it!, it’s not a question of getting rid of Maduro, it’s a question of presenting proposals and offering alternatives to the status quo, so far the motto has been “primero vamos a salir de Maduro” yeah but then what?, and another thing, how does the people know they’re not gonna be used for political purposes once again? at least the psuv gives them a clap bag, what has the mud offered?

  24. This Washington Post piece underscores the catch 22 of the belief that elections will offer an out from the Chavo- Madurista Inferno of eternal recurrence. People put their hope in the ballot box but at the same time one has the nagging feeling that the game’s rigged from the get go. At the same time there’s the message that not voting is best since doing so only lends legitimacy to the crooked dictatorship. Damned if you do and ditto if you don’t. Where does leave us? Democracy in Venezuela is worth as much as the ever devaluing Bolívar. Nobody wants it but you need it to get by in the hell of eternal recurrence.

  25. Your acceptance of the legitimacy of the voting results at this early point in time is more stunning than the results themselves. Most folks go through various stages of denial when the results are greatly at odds with the predicted results and their own expressed hopes. You must realize that If there was no voter fraud then international intervention via sanctions is much more remote and that the international crowd will revert to their preferred course of mediation. And the Chavistas will rebut any claims of fraud and calls for investigations of fraud with admissions of legitimacy from their opponents like yours. Your story is that 61% voted and the fair result was a Chavista victory and you say that as an advocate of democratic change. I would have expected you to take a wait and see attitude about the legitimacy of the vote. Does not your early concesdion strengthen those who advocate those who advocate force of arms. Color me stunned.

    • Nothing new here. He has always cherished his role of dissenter. Has bet his writing career on it. More so when the stakes are high….did not miss a beat with Washington Post. In the old days, there was Miguel Octavio as the electoral authority. Today there’s no one to put the brakes on this freak.

  26. So the results were pretty much the same as if they would have decided not to participate amidst the truly unfair conditions. I wonder: was it worth it for the crap they got? In my opinion: no.

  27. No way PSUV allows a fair vote. This was never in the hands of voters. Even if every oppo voted twice you would have still lost by a wide margin. If PSUV couldnt manufacfure the results the election would never have taken place.

  28. I find it funny that opposition was given only the frontier states.

    We know who the government going to get all the blame for all the contraband 🙂

  29. Once again, supposedly 61% of 20mm voted, or roughly 12mm, and 54% of these, or roughly 6.5mm, which is about 33% of the supposed REP electorate, voted for the Regime, vs. a maximum 20% pro-Regime poll statistics; thus, we must assume that ALL pro-Regime Chavistas/Maduristas turned out to vote for the Regime gubernatorial candidates (20% x 20mm=4mm), PLUS 13% more of the total REP (13% x 20mm=2.6mm) of so-called NiNis/Oppo also voted for Regime gubernatorial candidates–abstention, my ass. What does CC need more than prima facie statistics to prove the absurdity of the “Abstention” causal argument? Of course, FT/et.al. must be aligned with Jaua, who, in his usual brilliant analysis, said that the Gubernatorial vote was a “voto castigo” against the Oppo. As Prof. Ellis of the U. S. Army War College said (a co-participant with FT in the recent Washington Sub-Committee hearings, (where, FT, incidentally, closed his appearance with the brilliant, “Let’s not intervene with force in Venezuela–it will cause too much hurt”), the main problem currently with Venezuela is that it’s governed by a narco-criminal Regime looting the Country to line its own pockets, and there is no protocol internationally other than violating national sovereignty for dealing effectively with this type of Regime…..

    • “… the Gubernatorial vote was a “voto castigo” against the Oppo. ”

      Kinda a stupid explanation, since in the past elections the MUD got only three states and now has five.

      “Let’s not intervene with force in Venezuela–it will cause too much hurt”

      Not more than the almost 30 thousand chavista-brand murders happening accross the country.

  30. There’s only one man on earth who can save Venezuela…who has the means to save it…who has the WILL to save it…

    But CC disparages him at every opportunity, and a lot of shmucks here, WAY too many shmucks here, disparage him as stupid, evil, imperialistic, etc.

    And that’s Trump.

    You don’t want his help? Or only want it on YOUR terms?

    Good. You’ll get nothing.

    Enjoy your next excursion scraping through garbage bags, and burying your innocent babies.

    Your pride disgusts me.

    • Sr. Ira-cundo, your singlemindedness is comical. Go Trump, he’s our man! Oh, but wait I think he’s busy studying for the IQ test.

    • So we are being exploited by a foreign invader right now, and the solution is to let another form of invader come in and do things on his own terms . And that being a populist who behaves irrationally and acts erratically and always for his own self interest. ummm….

      I think i´ll pass.

      all these radicals seem to can´t wait for the US military to blow us to pieces so us that we still live here have to suffer that on top of the shit we are already in. Is like venezuelans abroad get off on torture porn of other venezuelans,

      • “I think i´ll pass. ”

        “Mejor el malo conocido que nos está asesinando por docenas al día que dejar de lado el orgullito patriotero inútil”

        “all these radicals seem to can´t wait for the US military to blow us to pieces”

        “All us the peaceful and reasonable ones want is to see how chavismo murders dozens and dozens everyday, because as long as I don’t have to see them it’s okay.”

      • “So we are being exploited by a foreign invader right now, and the solution is to let another form of invader come in and do things on his own terms”

        That, and most of the rest of your post is a false assumption as far as I’m concerned. I still don’t understand why so many react so negatively to the thought of the only man in the world right now who could actually make a difference in Venzuela, doing something to get us out of this disaster. Here’s where I’d normally go on a rant about the subject and drop the F-bomb 20 times but I’ve come to accept Venezuela for whom she is. And she is what she is.

        Poster William Crispin once described her best:

        She had not eaten for days and looked both pale and gaunt. Glancing down at the food on her plate provided by a stranger she noted wistfully that some of the spices were not to her liking.

    • I agree with Ira on this one.

      The opposition should be relying on Trump right now, giving that he is willing to commit for the Venezuelan cause. But it seems to me that the opposition is not taking advantage of that situation, or are less than willing to use that Trump card.

      It’s disgusting that the zurdos within the MUD can’t leave aside their ideological intransigence in order to forge a strategy in concert with the US state department along with the European Union, so that we can achieve a transition.

      AD + UNT, I’m looking at you!

      I think the MUD should dissolve and let others take up the mantle of the opposition.

      • B+ for the “less than willing to use the Trump card” bit but an F for suggesting the unhinged one is a solution for Venezuela.

        • The unhinged one? The only one on the world stage who gives a SHIT about the suffering going on in VZ?

          You’re a fucking idiot, but I’m sure you’ve heard that many times in your life.

          Go fuck yourself for letting babies die, and criticizing the only man on earth who gives a fuck to stop it.

          You are disgusting in every possible way!

          • I would not make this about POTUS. Whatever the U.S. government does is decided by the government and not one man alone. The government is keenly aware of what Venezuela represents. That there’s a shithead trio in Foggy Bottom is another thing but as stated, the Venezuela problem is well understood within the US government.

    • There is another person that can help Venezuela through the difficulties. (in addition to Trump), Kim Jong-in is looking a place he can performer above-ground testing of his latest devices. That would provide an opportunity to reduce the poverty rate, crime, overdependence oil, lack of food and medicine, need for housing, elimination of politicians. It’s in win-win solution.

        • baltachaveco and benenchufado, your eloquence sounds the same as the crazy Jersey lunatics depicted in South Park.

          chaveco trolls are too easy to spot these days, it’s like they aren’t trying anymore.

          • I’m more from The Simpsons generation so the South Park reference doesn’t ring a bell. But I can tell you I’m no chaveco of any kind. Frankly, I’m offended by the very idea.

        • Baltasar, don’t you think US makes a difference? What do you think of US efforts so far under DT? The US actually in leadership position don’t you agree? Ira is talking about future options. What’s wrong with that? In the meantime, lots of cards to play. What about the narcotics hand? You do know there’s a narcotics hand to play? What world leader or government official has survived a US narcotics indictment outside of Castro’s and Aristede? Can you survive a narcotics indictment? They have not even scratched the surface IMO.

  31. No lo creo. Simplemente no lo creo. Supongo que hay algo de lógica detrás de todo este análisis, supongo que las tendencias pueden revelar la importancia de la abstención… Pero no puedo creer como un gentío va a votar y decide volver a votar por un gobierno que los tiene pasando hambre, penuria e inseguridad. Conozco a muchos venezolanos, de muchas clases sociales, de muchos pueblos y ciudades, y no creo que ninguno sea tan estúpido para esto. Los números y la lógica pueden decir muchas cosas, pero hoy, hoy me voy más con mi instinto que con la lógica, y mi instinto es que el fraude es tan gordo, tan grande y tan fuerte, que you’re missing it -y yo también-.

  32. Quico,

    Just yesterday you were arguing that there was clearly massive fraud – without any evidence. Here, from your analysis at least, you appear to have leapt to the view that the headline CNE-announced results are a fair reflection of real votes cast – without any evidence.

    It is now Tuesday madrugada, and as yet the CNE has not posted results. When the results are available,, they can be downloaded to allow forensic analysis to see whether they show clear evidence of fraud or not. If they do show such evidence, it can also be assessed whether the fraud is outcome-determinant. Unless you have already been privy to such analysis via the detailed statistics held by the MUD then I would strongly recommend that you stop flip-flopping.

    If there is fraud here, the chances are that “It is not in the actas”. The likelihood is that “it is in the registros”. I sincerely hope that the MUD leadership do not make the same stupid mistake they made in 2013. They need to analyse the results FIRST and then request a FULL audit of the limited number of multi-table voting centres where the forensic analysis shows irregular voting at very high statistical likelihood. They should reject immediately any offer to just compare ballot paper to electronic vote. The CNE and the TSJ will turn down this request, or subvert it, but at least it will leave a smoking gun for the international community to see.

  33. The mistake was thinking this was a national election, Maduro has around 25% support but there are around 40% of chavistas, this chavistas will vote for a chavista candidate even if they are against Maduro. They turned out and voted for their party, some opposition abstained and there is your result.

  34. I don’t accept this explanation. The fraud was, as somebody said before, multi-factorial. To put it in words that Emi would use, nos lo metieron por todos lados.

    We knew this would happen, what I am amazed at is MUD’s inaction and ineptitude at dealing with it. Again. Really. And where is Capriles?

    I would never abstain but I understand those who did.

  35. From the MUD announcement as reported in El Nacional today:-

    “Oropeza enfatizó que “el régimen asumió el camino del fraude, la violencia, manipulación, ventajismo, trampa, corrupción, extorsión y chantaje, para desconocer la voluntad del pueblo”. Ante ello, la coalicióninsistió en que desconocerá los resultados hasta que se produzca una auditoría cuantitativa y cualitativa que no sea impuesta por el Poder Electoral, en la que se revise el contenido de las actas con las cajas, y que sea profunda e independiente para que se pueda despejar cualquier duda.”

    I have made my own opinion clear in several previous comments that I thought that the MUD leadership was misguided at best to accept the gubernatorial elections on ACN terms. The present outcome and the current opposition dilemma were entirely predictable.

    However, this comment by Oropeza brings me to a state of total despair. Is it possible that the MUD leadership still do not understand the nature of the fraud perpetrated in 2013? Or has the entire MUD leadership entered into a Faustian pact with Chavismo? The third possibility is that Oropeza actually believes that the vote is legitimate (apart from the obvious intimidation, voting obstacles and other common abuses of regime power) and is deliberately making a stupid request for an ill-defined universal audit, knowing it will be rejected or honoured in the breach. Alice meets the white rabbit.

    He wants to compare “actas con las cajas”. While this is probably a good idea for a limited number of carefully selected samples, it will not expose the type of fraud used in the 2013 elections, and could on its own prove counterproductive (as it has done before). The highly improbable added votes in 2013 appear in both machine and caja. For practical reasons, it is unlikely that these votes can be entirely accounted for by physical persons exercising multiple votes – this would require an army running between voting centres. Any valid audit MUST therefore examine the cuadernos de votacion to verify evidence of physical presence of voters and the tally against machine totals, and for credibility the audit request should be limited to centres which show unequivocal evidence of manipulation in the form of voting irregularity (extreme Z scores under the assumption of homogeneous voting pattern within a single voting centre).

    An ill-defined request for an audit of the entire universe leaves the CNE the plausible excuse of rejecting the request on grounds of practicality – as they have done before. As it is, I have no doubt that the CNE with support from the TSJ will deny any well-crafted audit request in any event, but the rejection of a reasonable limited audit request removes any fig-leaf of credibility.
    It seems to me that the MUD leadership never misses an opportunity to miss an opportunity.

    • Actually, this is it.

      The FRAUD is not in the ACTAS is in the cuadernos (huellas: un votante son varios votos y así). Find out what happened in the six municipalities in estado Miranda (Acevedo, Andrés Bello, Brion, Buroz, Páez and Pedro Gual) where psuv increased its votes by more than 50% while in places were they were not allowed to make a massive fraud (like Chacao, Baruta, El Hatillo, Los Salias, Carrizal, Leoncio Martínez o Los Teques) they lost more than 10% of its votes.

      This is the pattern everywhere around the country.

      P. S. My opinion: The “wins” in Zulia and Táchira are because they wanted to behead Vielma Mora and Arias (“los moderados”) and the other three small states are along with Táchira the prize for all the favours HRA has done for the psuv. And the situation with Andrés Veláaquez is part of a show to induce the idea that the fraud is in the actas and make people think “if Andrés has the actas and wins then the rest of the states were legally lost” given the psuv-govt the needed legitimacy inside and outside the country. So given away 4 or 5 states it doesn’t mean anything because now on (if people se traga el fraude) they will rule forever!!!

      And that’s why it’s really SAD to read articles (including in CC, buying the whole made up- story. Please people think before you speak or write!!! IT WAS A FRAUD!

      And by the way just to be as clear as possible: Chávez sí ganó todas las elecciones con votantes y siempre fue mayoría, pero la situación económica era 180 grados distinta!!! Sus trampas eran el abuso de los recursos públicos (que usaba como si fueran del psuv para comprar a los votantes) y de coerción usando las listas de las misiones. Pero esta vez, en esta regional del 2017 fue un FRAUDE porque inyectaron millones de votos sin votantes!!!

  36. This whole affair was terribly handled by opposition leaders. They were blinded by greed. They could have saved face and avoided this terrible defeat by maintaining a firm ground and not participating lest conditions were adequate and keeping protesters active on the street.

  37. With Zulia, Táchira and Mérida on the other side of the political spectrum it’s only fitting that in a Gocho-Maracucho alliance they join Colombia. Heck, history, economics and family already link them to neighboring Colombia, why no make it official. Those in the rest of Venezuela who want to are welcome to come along.

  38. I think what happened is actually simpler.

    We lost, because MUD leadership did not raise up to the task at hand. FIRST, they accepted impossible conditions and THEN did not organize properly to avoid the obvious, hence we are fucked.

    Con los amigos de la MUD, quien necesita enemigos?

    • “ND / 16 oct 2017.- El vicepresidente Ejecutivo de la República, Tareck El Aissami, confirmó la mañana de este lunes que el Partido Socialista Unido de Venezuela se quedó también con el estado Bolívar en las elecciones regionales celebradas este domingo.

      Por su cuenta en la red social Twitter, el también dirigente del Partido Socialista Unido de Venezuela afirmó: “Son 18… Viva Bolívar”.

      La presidenta del Consejo Nacional Electoral, Tibisay Lucena, dijo anoche que los números para la hora no eran irreversibles en el estado fronterizo y pues ya casi al medio día de este lunes El Aissami confirma al victoria del Psuv.

      Por su parte Andrés Velasquez, candidato por la Mesa de la Unidad Democrática, aseguró por Twitter que tiene los resultados que lo dan como victorioso. Además convocó a una movilización hacia el CNE regional.”

      • AV by last official CNE figures was up 5m votes with 99% tabulated. The remaining 1% or so to be tabulated, even if ALL were allocated to the PSUV candidate, would still give AV a 150 vote victory. And, the CNE/DC/TEA are declaring the PSUV candidate victorious–hey, but don’t worry CC/FT/RS/et. al., it’s all the fault of the Oppo abstencionistas….

  39. OAS Chief Luis Almagro on yesterday’s election:

    “It is clear that any political force that agrees to participate in an election without guarantees becomes an essential tool of the eventual fraud, and shows that it has no democratic reflexes to protect the rights of the people, in this case, the right to the vote.”

    Nuff said.

  40. OAS Secretary General Luis Almagro on yesterday’s farce:

    “It is clear that any political force that agrees to participate in an election without guarantees becomes an essential tool of the eventual fraud, and shows that it has no democratic reflexes to protect the rights of the people, in this case, the right to the vote.”

    Nuff said.

  41. Someone help me out here.

    As I understand what he’s saying, Quico is hung up on the idea that if the number of voters casting ballots at a certain precinct is 10,000 on the “actas” and the CNE says the machine recorded 10,000 votes for that same precinct, then where’s the fraud? Is that correct?

    Or is it a matter of the acta saying that X number of voters voted for candidate A, and X number of voters voted for candidate B? And the machine concurs. Is that the case?

    I’ve always assumed that the number of voters voting at each precinct was known, but the vote itself was secret.

    If the vote was secret, then what’s to keep the CNE from accurately reporting the number of votes cast but monkeying with who voted for whom?

    As I’ve said before, all those yutes from the barrios “getting their voices heard” would be useful tools for the regime.

  42. He is saying this is status quo and all fair and normal. Has never and will never take high road, not his style. Easier to go with the flow than against? He owns this space and hustling American public vía WaPo IMO.

  43. FALSE. All of the dirty tricks Ocariz decried have been structural features of the Venezuelan Elections System at least since 2012. This statement is totally FALSE.

    The tinta indeleble was used in every single election till this one. The carné de la patria did not exist till this election, which by the way let anyone to vote showing a carné instead of a cédula.

    And the third variable was the fanb. The fanb (the same people of the plan república) showed that was ready for anything against the country when they contained the people during four months committing all kind of atrocities against the people.

    And those three variables are the key.

    When the psuv-govt-cne became the fanb-psuv-govt cne la mesa quedó servida. First they announced 8M votes for the constituyente. And they knew the world did not believe. So they needed something better.

    And they prepared the largest injection of votes ever. Around three million votes (I commented in another post why 3 M).

    That’s why the FRAUD is not in the ACTAS. And all people waiting for the actas are like corderitos. The FRAUD was the PERFECT CRIME because no dejo huellas (literalmente busquen las huellas de los votantes en los cuadernos de votación y allí van a dar con el fraude masivo).

    The psuv engaño al mundo entero con la complicidad de HRA y otros pseudo líderes. Inyectaron 3 M y fue así como subió “la participación récord” de más de 60%.

    Para demostrar lo FALSO del argumento de que las condiciones de 2015 y 2017 fueron iguales, falta con recordar que el diputado 112 (que le daba los 2/3 de la AN a la OPO y con esta una super mayoría) fue logrado por apenas 85 votos en una zona ultra chavista y rural. Y allí el psuv-cne no pudo meter 86 votos hasta las diez de la noche sencillamente porque les era imposible por la tinta en el dedo, la cédula de identidad y unas fanb que aun no habían sido totalmente secuestradas (fueron convertidas en un regimiento del psuv durante las protestas), y de hecho en las elecciones del 2015 las fanb protegieron al pueblo del asedio de los colectivos paramilitres que trataban de asediar unos centros de votación en el estado Sucre. Así que el argumento de que las condiciones eran las mismas es FALSO y con esa ingenuidad le haces coro al psuv. SAD.


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